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Making H3


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#1 RegimentalPyro

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Posted 02 April 2005 - 08:42 AM

Now this may have been asked before, but due to a forum software quirk [cannot enter search terms less than 4 characters long] I am unable to locate the thread. My apologies if I am reposting.

I am about to have a bash at making Shimizu's H3 for the purpose of bursting my smaller [2-3inch] shells.

77 Potassium Chlorate
23 Charcoal
+2 Dextrin

The reason I am going down this path is because I have previously been using small [1-2g] flash bags, with mealed ricecrispies, and I want to move away from this stuff. Apart from any safety considerations, the brightness of the flash break ruins the more subtle star effects.

Now Shimizu states that H3 is suprisingly stable by comparison to other chlorate comps, but that does not mean it's not a lot more friction sensitive than my trusty KNO3 stuff, so I have a few questions I would like to have answered before I start.


Q1 Obviously milling the comp is out - I plan to screen the Chlorate and the charcoal together. However my Chlorate is quite lumpy to begin with. How would you recommend I deal with this? Are there any problems with putting the Chlorate into a electrical coffee grinder first to get it as fine as possible to begin with?

Q2 What form should I make the H3 into. The comp. specifies dextrin which implies a substrate is needed for the burst. Should I make it into granules by pushing through a screen, or should I coat ricecrispies with it. Should it just be left powdered?

Q3 Any tips to offer? Any pitfalls to beware of. Should I even be considering H3? Is there another burst charge more suitable?

edit: Additional question! Any thoughts on what sort of charcoal to use? I'm currently milling down BBQ charcoal for this and other projects [it's always useful!] Should I be using willow instead


OK - Enough with the questions. My safety precautions thus far are as follows.
  • No sulphur, or sulphur compounds around the work area at all.
  • Small quantities to begin with [50g]
  • New or utterly clean equipment to mix with
  • Complete cleanup of work area before starting, and after finishing
All advice greatfully received..

Edited by RegimentalPyro, 02 April 2005 - 09:10 AM.


#2 chris17

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Posted 02 April 2005 - 10:13 AM

I have little experience with H3. When i first made it, i remember being disappointed in how slow it burned. My mistake was to use it as plain powder. Later i've heard the best way is to granulate it or apply on rice hulls. Below are two videos(not made by me) of different approaches to H3. The first one i believe is plain powdered H3. The second is granulated H3.


When i made H3, i milled the charcoal in my ball mill and screened it together with the Chlorate. If you need to make your chlorate finer, i suggest you use a mortar and pestle. It might be better to start of with Shimizu's KP, since it uses Perchlorate instead of Chlorate.

http://www.pyrosource.com/H3.wmv

http://www.pyrosourc...3Granulated.wmv

#3 Yugen-biki

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Posted 02 April 2005 - 10:41 AM

RegimentalPyro

Q1 Obviously milling the comp is out - I plan to screen the Chlorate and the charcoal together. However my Chlorate is quite lumpy to begin with. How would you recommend I deal with this? Are there any problems with putting the Chlorate into a electrical coffee grinder first to get it as fine as possible to begin with?


I make mine by first mill the charcoal and potassiumchlorate sepparatly in my ball mill. I mill it as long as it takes to become a very very fine powder (C: about 40h; KClO3 about 20h).
The dextrine is milled together with the coal.
I have never used a coffee grinder, and can't say how this machine will do in terms of grinding.
A ball mill is quite good at dealing with hard lumps of chlorate, if given some time.
The two ingredients are mixed in an open container some what homogenous. The mixture is then screened at least two times. When the two powders are very finely ground they tend to clump together, and a fine mesh is needed to get rid of them. But NEVER force the H3 through the screen. If you have to do this to get it through, the mesh net is to fine.


Q2 What form should I make the H3 into. The comp. specifies dextrin which implies a substrate is needed for the burst. Should I make it into granules by pushing through a screen, or should I coat ricecrispies with it. Should it just be left powdered?


One important thing to remember is that the H3 must be a very fine powder to work properly! This fine powder is used to coat a non flamable material like corn-cobs or rice-hulls. But this might be hard to get, I have heard people that use "puffer rice". I have never used the rice but tested some other things. Weet hulls works OK but tend to be to small. Then I tested some quite coarce wooden "splinters"/"chips". They works very good and does not leave glowing embers when the shell breaks. I have tested wooden chips from both drilling and "shavings from a electrical plane" (eng translation?). The wooden shis were about 5mm to 20mm.
If the H3 is left as a powder, it won't work at all. It must be in some kind of granulated state. Pushed through a screen is a waste of powder as not all the powder in a shell burns long enough to have time to propell the stars.
A coating of 4 parts of H3 to 1 part wood shavings/crispies/hulls... is what is used for 2-4 inch shells (by wheight).
I personly find 2% of dexrin to little and use about 4 to maby 5% with good results.
Coating the hulls is quite easy:
First wheigh up 100g of wood ships. Soak them in warm water and prees out the eccess by hand.
Now put the moist wood in a container with a tight lid, and gently scoop in 400g of H3. Now shake it and "spin" it by hand untill you hear a "ratteling noise" (only a few minutes).
Let dry for a week and use.

Q3 Any tips to offer? Any pitfalls to beware of. Should I even be considering H3? Is there another burst charge more suitable?
edit: Additional question! Any thoughts on what sort of charcoal to use? I'm currently milling down BBQ charcoal for this and other projects [it's always useful!] Should I be using willow instead


Use a dust mask and clothes that you are not affraid to lose! This comp is VERY dusty when finely milled. As said before, 2% dextrin might be at the bottom range. 4% might be better. And squeese the wooden ships very hard by hand. Because if to wet they will clump together and form a mess. This can be helped easy by adding more dry powder. But if ypou don't have more dry powder at hand think of this.
I don't think there is another burst that can be used with the same charateristics. Maby KP with some additional flash or whistle booster will probaly work. But then you are back were you started with flash.
I use the same quallity as to my BP. This is needed to get the best performence out of the burst. Use willow, but BBQ might work. Try both.
And when you load the shells, use a thin paper barrier between the stars and H3. H3 that comes into the space where the stars should be, is a waste of burst. And fill the shells quite full. This helps holdning the stars in place!


Thats about it...I think...

About granulation (and thoughts on chris17 post)

It is true that granulation makes the burts faster. This is also why BP-lift for shells is granulated. But this is not the complete truth. As the preasuse in the shel increases the force of the H3 increases. In this whay the H3 if very powerfull when put in a container like a shell. The granulation helps the fire to spread eavenly through out the shells and helps greatly to from a shperical shape of the burst. And also important, the speed with wich it burns.
A mortar and pestle will get you soar blisters all over your hands if you try to make more that about 100g or less. I only use my mortar and pestle when i make about 5-10g tests of new comps.
KP or H3 is up to you. It is possible to work safely with H3, and KP is not as powerfull as H3 and a booster might be needed.

Edited by Yugen-biki, 02 April 2005 - 11:00 AM.


#4 chris17

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Posted 02 April 2005 - 11:13 AM

As the preasuse in the shel increases the force of the H3 increases. In this whay the H3 if very powerfull when put in a container like a shell. The granulation helps the fire to spread eavenly through out the shells and helps greatly to from a shperical shape of the burst.

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That is very true. I didn't phrase it very well. I believe the same thing applies to any powder. This is also why it is important to close and paste the shell well, when using loose powder. In my experience it is harder to create a symmetrical break using fine powder. This is why 'extra' care should be taken when building the shell.
Correct me if wrong though.

Btw, i don't think it would be advisable to use H3 with stars that contain sulfur beacuse of presence of the Chlorate, even when you use a layer of paper between the burst and stars, just to be sure.

Edited by chris17, 02 April 2005 - 11:18 AM.


#5 Jerronimo

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Posted 02 April 2005 - 11:37 AM

I have had great succes with 6:1 BP/hulls and a wistlemix ''booster''

The main advantage is that u can change the amount of wistle and in that way
adjust the force of the breakcharge.
You also won't get a distracting flash.

I use about 3 gram for 3'' and about 5 grams for 4''
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