4 replies to this topic

[Strobe]

Hi,

I saw this kit to make those novelty pull string friction poppers (for lack of a better word). These are basically a small tube with a string on either end that pops when the strings are pulled. I think they are used in party poppers and several other commerical novelty fireworks. This kit comes from firefox but i think I've seen another somewhere else.

http://www.firefox-fx.com/kits.htm

Its the very top item on that link.

My question is: what would the ignition comp be that is mixed in with Potassium Chlorate (KC is not included in the kit by the way). I thought chlorate based friction mixtures were dangerous, which seems at odds with selling it as a kit.

Now before anyone gets excited, I'm intending to go mix up a batch. Nor I am not knocking firefox, they just happen to have one of these kits. I guess I'm just confused about all of the warnings you see about using chlorates as a begginner and the sale of kits that basically encourage thier use. I would guess that a begginer would be more inclined to purchase such a kit than someone who is experienced. Are the comps for something like the one above safer than I am thinking they are?

I suppose the same question would apply to the A/B flash mixes that many vendors sell. On one site I saw an A/B flash kit for an ounce total that cautioned that the whole kit should be mixed at one time (otherwise you might get the ratios wrong). Isnt mixing a 28 gram batch of flash at one time something that is not generally recommended?

[fishy1]

I have a pretty good idea of what is it, I suspect it's a mixture of two chemicals or one of them on it's own. I don't feel comfortable telling you what I suspect it is, as I could be mistaken, and also it is a deathmix in every sense of the word.

[Strobe]

Sorry, I hope my post didnt come accross as fishing for dangerous recipes. I have copies of both Tenney Davis' and John Donner's books, so I've read about armstrong's mix and a half a dozen similar compositions.

I am curious what this specific type of kit is made of, but more from the point of view whether its something like the older formulas in Davis' book or if this is some more recently composition (or method) that is safer. The fact that its even sold makes me wonder what its made of, since it would seem down right irresponsible for a company to market a product that promotes inexperienced people working with a death mix. Even though the kit itself doesn't include the oxidizer, the same company or several others sell it. So it kind of makes me wonder if it really is death mix or something else.

Also, again, it wasn't my intent to single out Firefox specifically. I think I've seen at least one other site that sells a similar kit though I can't seem to find it now. But to leave firefox out of it, there are plenty of other companies that sell A/B flash mixes. While flash isnt considered a death mix in the same sense as some of the comps used a long time ago for torpedos and such, its not exactly the kind of thing begginers should be using.

Perhaps I am looking at it wrong, but in my mind A/B kits would be geared more towards people who don't know what A and B are. If you don't know what A and B are in terms of flash or friction/shock mixes, should you even using them?

I hope I didn't step outside of subject matter this forum was created to discuss, but personally I think its a legitimate question. If its inappropriate subject matter here, I can take the question elsewhere.

[fishy1]

While flash isnt considered a death mix in the same sense as some of the comps used a long time ago for torpedos and such, its not exactly the kind of thing begginers should be using.

Standard flash (Perc/Al) is not a death mix, it's just something you have to be very careful with and respect it. The comp firefox are selling is specifically designed to be friction sensitive, it's lethal.

I don't think your inappropriate, I too much prefer to make something than buy a far more expensive rip off version. I do perhaps sometimes go too far, like when I wanted a woodturning lathe and couldn't bear the £100 price tag, so I build one for pocket change and I'm now onto building a metal spinning lathe, mainly casted from aluminium, for the challenge. The only parts I anticipate buying are a couple of threaded rods and bolts and a cutter and a chuck as I can't seen an easy way to cast one. Anyways, slightly off topic.

Edited by fishy1, 07 March 2007 - 10:39 PM.

[Strobe]

Standard flash (Perc/Al) is not a death mix, it's just something you have to be very careful with and respect it. The comp firefox are selling is specifically designed to be friction sensitive, it's lethal.

I don't think your inappropriate, I too much prefer to make something than buy a far more expensive rip off version. I do perhaps sometimes go too far, like when I wanted a woodturning lathe and couldn't bear the £100 price tag, so I build one for pocket change and I'm now onto building a metal spinning lathe, mainly casted from aluminium, for the challenge. The only parts I anticipate buying are a couple of threaded rods and bolts and a cutter and a chuck as I can't seen an easy way to cast one. Anyways, slightly off topic.

I agree and wasn't trying to imply flash is a death mix, just dangerous if not handled properly. I've not ordered either type of kit so I can't say what kind of instructions, safety cautions and warnings are supplied with them. Perhaps they make it very clear what the risks are and how to avoid problems.

So your thoughts are that there really isnt a safe alternative to the 'death mixes' for friction sensitve compounds and so that friction kit is not safe. I suppose that answers my question, though it would be interesting to hear what other people opinions are as well, if anyone else cares to comment.

I don't know about anyone else, but I find it ironic that some of the few legal fireworks (at least in many states within the US) are the most dangerous to make. I mean products like the pull string poppers discussed above and things like snap - n - pops.

Your wood lathe and metal lathe projects sound interesting. I've always wanted a wood lathe but can't afford one. This might not be the best thread to discuss it on, but could you maybe PM me if you have any links that discuss how to build your own?