17 replies to this topic

[Bonny]

I made my first batch of veline green stars last weekend, but am unsure as to what to prime them with. I made cut stras with sizes ranging from 1/4" to 1/2". I do not have potassium dichromate which is listed as part of veline's prime. Could this prime be made without it? Would a "universal prime" (don't remember where I found it) work? It is basically black powder with aluminum and some silicon added.

Thanks

[Creepin_pyro]

Here is a 'veline style' prime with no Dichromate which might be a better choice:

Name: veline style
Source: pax
Potassium Perchlorate 62
Charcoal Airfloat 22
Magnalium, granular, -200 mesh 7
Dextrin 4
Aluminum, flake, dark, American dark. -325 mesh 3
Copper(II) Oxide, black 2

I've used this before to prime Veline stars (with a final dusting of green meal) with great results. If you do have wood meal try adding a few % - it makes the stars fluffy so you're more likely to get 100% ignition.

I'd try step-priming if you do use a BP-based prime - Veline's stars are quite tricky to light...

[Bonny]

Creepin_pyro, on Jun 6 2007, 05:36 PM, said:

Here is a 'veline style' prime with no Dichromate which might be a better choice:

Name: veline style
Source: pax
Potassium Perchlorate 62
Charcoal Airfloat 22
Magnalium, granular, -200 mesh 7
Dextrin 4
Aluminum, flake, dark, American dark. -325 mesh 3
Copper(II) Oxide, black 2

I've used this before to prime Veline stars (with a final dusting of green meal) with great results. If you do have wood meal try adding a few % - it makes the stars fluffy so you're more likely to get 100% ignition.

I'd try step-priming if you do use a BP-based prime - Veline's stars are quite tricky to light...

Thanks,
I'll prime this weekend and see. I'm assuming then, one layer of this prime then the green meal? Also,what exactly is wood meal...fine sawdust??

Edited by Bonny, 06 June 2007 - 06:37 PM.

[pyromaniac303]

Creepin_pyro, on Jun 6 2007, 06:36 PM, said:

If you do have wood meal try adding a few % - it makes the stars fluffy so you're more likely to get 100% ignition.

Do you mean add the wood meal to the star comp its self? or just the prime? By the way youve said it you seem to mean the stars but I would have thought that would affect the colour.

[Creepin_pyro]

Sorry if that was vague - I was reffering to the prime, not the stars themselves.

Veline's 'super prime' contains wood meal to make the stars fuzzy (a better word than fluffy now I think about it!) - it increases surface area and combats the problem of rolled stars being relatively hard to light compared to cut ones. I've never heard of it being used in the stars themselves, although its use in some coloured lance comps suggests it doesn't affect the colour much.

[pyrotrev]

I had some parlon bound violet-blue perc oxidised stars which I was having a lot of problem lighting, so tried a silicon based igniter:

BP (fine meal) 40
KNO3 30
Silicon 300 mesh 25
Magnalium 250 mesh 5

which seems to do the job just fine...

The magnalium probably isn't essential, however it provides a bit of extra sparking which could be useful if you're using it on the "output" side of a delay fuse e.g. in a shell - I wanted a prime which is as universal as possible

[BrightStar]

pyrotrev, on Jun 9 2007, 01:20 PM, said:

I had some parlon bound violet-blue perc oxidised stars which I was having a lot of problem lighting, so tried a silicon based igniter...

Nice to know the new Si powder is working well :-)

I'd be interested to know if there is a rule of thumb as to how much prime to use, or indeed what you guys have found to work.

Given my BP step priming method, a 3:1:1 ratio by mass of perc based star comp / step prime / BP prime works for me, but would this ordinarily be considered excessive?

[Bonny]

[quote name='Creepin_pyro' date='Jun 6 2007, 05:36 PM' post='34945']
Here is a 'veline style' prime with no Dichromate which might be a better choice:

Name: veline style
Source: pax
Potassium Perchlorate 62
Charcoal Airfloat 22
Magnalium, granular, -200 mesh 7
Dextrin 4
Aluminum, flake, dark, American dark. -325 mesh 3
Copper(II) Oxide, black 2

I've used this before to prime Veline stars (with a final dusting of green meal) with great results. If you do have wood meal try adding a few % - it makes the stars fluffy so you're more likely to get 100% ignition.

I'd try step-priming if you do use a BP-based prime - Veline's stars are quite tricky to light...

I used 1 layer on the stars and fired some in a mine and also a 1" shell.This prime worked great. I didn't use any meal powder over top as I was running out of time and wanted to test the stars.
Thanks

[Bonny]

Regarding this prime. I'm assuming a shell should never be loaded with perc stars primed with this prime (no BP layer) and chlorate stars? The prime contains aluminum and magnalium powders which are not supposed to be mixed with chlorates...

[Caramanos2000]

Tried my hand at some stars. Made some firefly pumped. Very nice and ignite super easy. However the Shimizu blue are a pain to get going, can I just use Bp slurry?
http://s104.photobuc...ShimizuBlue.flv

Edited by Caramanos2000, 29 June 2007 - 04:23 AM.

[BrightStar]

Caramanos2000, on Jun 29 2007, 04:57 AM, said:

Tried my hand at some stars. Made some firefly pumped. Very nice and ignite super easy. However the Shimizu blue are a pain to get going, can I just use Bp slurry?

Probably not... you could add some MgAl or similar make it hotter, but it won't guarantee 100% ignition with Perc based stars.

With Conkling Blue which looks similar, step priming always works well for me. Mix up some more blue comp, screen together with 50% by mass BP meal and maybe an extra 2% dextrin. Dampen your blue stars with a sprayer and roll them in this mix - just tumbling them in a plastic pot while sprinkling on the powder works well enough.

Once dry, dampen and roll them again in BP meal with some green mix + 5% dextrin. I'm sure there's a quicker method, but this doesn't require any additional chems and works every time for me

Edited by BrightStar, 29 June 2007 - 02:39 PM.

[Bonny]

Caramanos2000, on Jun 29 2007, 03:57 AM, said:

Tried my hand at some stars. Made some firefly pumped. Very nice and ignite super easy. However the Shimizu blue are a pain to get going, can I just use Bp slurry?
http://s104.photobuc...ShimizuBlue.flv

You might want to make the stars smaller... you'll have to put that up about a mile so it burns out before it hits the ground!

[Caramanos2000]

Yeah thought about that. They were still damp. They do burn for long though. They are about the size of an airsoft round so 6mm.

[Bonny]

Caramanos2000, on Jun 29 2007, 05:20 PM, said:

Yeah thought about that. They were still damp. They do burn for long though. They are about the size of an airsoft round so 6mm.

I have had similar problems with blue chlorate stars...even small ones seem to burn for quite awhile. I haven't made any blue perc stars yet, but will be experimenting with the whole Veline system in the next few weeks...hope it goes well.

[portfire]

Creepin_pyro, on Jun 6 2007, 06:36 PM, said:

Here is a 'veline style' prime with no Dichromate which might be a better choice:

Name: veline style
Source: pax
Potassium Perchlorate 62
Charcoal Airfloat 22
Magnalium, granular, -200 mesh 7
Dextrin 4
Aluminum, flake, dark, American dark. -325 mesh 3
Copper(II) Oxide, black 2

I've used this before to prime Veline stars (with a final dusting of green meal) with great results. If you do have wood meal try adding a few % - it makes the stars fluffy so you're more likely to get 100% ignition.

I'd try step-priming if you do use a BP-based prime - Veline's stars are quite tricky to light...

I'll be experimenting with the veline color system this week.I'v been looking at step-priming but,i have all the chems needed for the 'veline style' prime so may go for that.I can source dichromate for the 'super prime' but don't want to go near the stuff,for good reason.

I have a question with regards to wood meal.If it's there to make the stars "fuzzy",could MDF dust(70-80 mesh) be used instead?As it is light and "fluffy".

dean