41 replies to this topic

[portfire]

I mix it in my bedroom. The anti-static wrist band is a good idea.

Yeah, the anti-static wrist band IS a good idea, mixing flash in your bedroom is NOT, and another composition for that matter. For you to say that It's all bullshit, just shows your naievity, and the complete lack of respect for energitic materials......Be prepared for a warning

[cooperman435]

D3v you have said it perfectly yourself "you dont get it"

It CAN go wrong (no one here is saying it will definately will go wrong) MUCH more easily with flash than many other compositions and the more importaint part is that if it does the consequences are FAR more severe.

Dont be arrogant and listen to what these people are saying to youfor your own safety, why else would they say it they have nothing to "scam" out of you.

Its not 99.99% Bull Shit but 100% relavant safety information.

[Arthur Brown]

Look at both of these links, show them to your mother.

http://members.shaw....nsequences.html




If (when!) you spill flash powder into the carpet how are you going to clear it up. It will get into the works of the vacuum cleaner and blow the whole thing up - filling you with dirty shrapnel.

You are heading for a Darwin award

[Creepin_pyro]

http://members.shaw....nsequences.html

Hehe - you beat me to it : )

For those that haven't seen this 'consequences' page, it does contain some graphic content. Vital viewing though, IMHO, for anyone who intends to mess with flash!

[Frozentech]

Thanks G7 but I thought the risk of static ignition was pretty much exclusive only to sulpher/chlorate based flash comps and not perchorlate ones???

p.s I read the link and the only rule I break is handling the stuff on a carpet. Again though, is perch flash okay to handle while standing on a carpet?

I would say NOT. I only mix it wearing all cotton clothing (or Nomex/Aramid coveralls sometimes ) on clean bare floors, and spray anti-static spray around my work area and sleeves. I really don't want my shop to become a junkyard pile of lumber and plaster with me in the center of it.

Standard 70/30 has gone off from static, from dropping a small plastic tub 3 or 4 feet onto the ground, from stepping on spilled flash on bare earth, and other reasons that left no survivor to say how. Take every precaution you can.

[Frozentech]

It just all seems so unlikely to happen. I see warnings of accidental ignition of flash akin to those of not speeding to fast in your car or not drinking/smoking. In other words the risks are basically non-existent. Unless you can show me a documented case of flash going off by static in a normal non-test environment then I will continue to find it very hard to believe. I have been mixing and packing flash on a carpet for quite some years now and dare I say it, compressed flash quite hard when I first started and I've never had an accident with it.

Please note I am only referring to perch-flash and not chlorate/sulpher.

Yikes ! You need to get some respect for the most hazardous composition in pyro.

You never will have an accident with it. Until you do. Usually the first flash accident is the last.
Does anyone have links to the pics of Tad K's accident ? I've misplaced the bookmark.

Like they say "there are old pyro's, and there are bold pyro's, but very few old, bold, pyro's"

[edit] I found the pics from the aftermath of the accident that killed Tad. No telling exactly what happened, since he died after being medivac'd to the burn center.
Witnesses just heard an explosion and saw pieces flying, then Tad staggered out into the yard, and reportedly his last words were "call my wife."

Aftermath of a Pyro Accident

Edited by Frozentech, 15 August 2008 - 08:24 PM.

[GZ22]

Listen mate. No one is trying to scare you. No one is trying to stop you from experimenting safely. Those of us that deal with energetics are great fans of common sense - it keeps us alive. You said:

"It just all seems so unlikely to happen. I see warnings of accidental ignition of flash akin to those of not speeding to fast in your car or not drinking/smoking. In other words the risks are basically non-existent...I will continue to find it very hard to believe...I've never had an accident with it."

Are you seriously trying to tell us that in all of history, there has been not one single recorded and proven incidence of a person dying from smoking related diseases? Or of death caused by alcohol related liver cirrhosis? Or even of someone killing themselves or another road user by exceeding the speed limit?

Please, get real. I know that you enjoy making flash, and that you enjoy the feeling of producing a salute. But you say that you have been making flash for years. I bet when you started off, you made small amounts, then, as your confidence grew, you progressed onto making larger batches. After all these years you are still seeking to make a louder bang with flash than any you have made previously. What happens if eventually you are tempted to make a larger device - which requires more composition - and the most terrible thing happens -an accidental ignition? Even if you don't go down that route, and stay making small amounts, you always run the risk of an accident taking place. Why do you think the HSE investigate detonations at explosives maufacturing plants, that have invested millions of pounds in blast mitigation measures? I'll tell you why - because all you can do is try to mitigate the effects of an accidental ignition - you cannot under any circumstances completely eliminate the possibility, simply try to ensure that if one does occur, the least damage to persons and property possible is the outcome. Think of the man who always said "Burglary - it'll never happen to me".

You would do VERY well to remember the old British Amry adage:

"One must never forget that the ultimate purpose of an explosive is to explode".

Energetics don't care when or how they are initiated - they initiate, and they do it very well.

[karlfoxman]

d3v,

Your warning level has been added to, you should listen to our members. The procedures you are following are very dangerous! If you keep showing this kind of attitude I will make sure its taken to the next level! YOU DO NOT TAKE ANY RISKS WITH FLASH! If you have any questions please PM me or any of the Admin/Mod team.

For your own safety follow advise given here, If you refuse to take our advise we will note your IP to save other people who may be caught in your dangerous experiments.

TAKE THIS AS A LAST WARNING!

Edited by karlfoxman, 15 August 2008 - 11:10 PM.

[pyrotrev]

ISince then I've built plenty of PC's and have never needed an anti-static band or anything of the sort.

If 1 in 200 cases someone blows a bus driver or RAM chip on a mother board it doesn't really matter, if you lose half your face it's a bit more important. Regarding how companies use flash in commercial manufacture, generally in the UK the container is charged with separate doses of oxidiser and metal powder, then sealed, and the whole caboodle is gently tumbled to mix the contents (usually a long way away from any one) - that way you're never having to handle mixed powder. I've heard of amateurs in the US doing esentially the same by shaking things on the end of a long bamboo cane.

[d3v]

Point taken, I realise now the dangers are after all realistic and I will be exercising much more caution from now on. I won't be mixing on a carpet anymore that's for sure. I honestly thought the whole safety debacle regarding flash was highly unrealistic but I have been convinced otherwise from you guys. Thanks.

[karlfoxman]

Thankyou for listening, please stay on our forums and enjoy your stay. Its all a learning curve, dont let us put you off pyrotechnics. If you want to see flash in large qty's look at vids of Maltese fireworks or Mascalettas from Spain just dont mix the way you have been.

[RegimentalPyro]

Flash powder is an extremely dangerous substance, which has killed / maimed many experienced pyrotechnicians. The reason it is mixed on-site is that it is too dangerous to transport safely.

I can see no further point in this discussion and am therefore closing it.